Colorado Shooter James Holmes & Darwin

Everyone knows by now about the news from Colorado: At least 12 dead, 50 injured in Colorado theater shooting.

Whenever there’s a disaster in the headlines, there’s one thing of which we can be certain — it will be blamed on Darwin by the neo-theocrats at the Discovery Institute‘s creationist public relations and lobbying operation, the Center for Science and Culture (a/k/a the Discoveroids, a/k/a the cdesign proponentsists).

In case you doubt that, here’s a bit of Discoveroid history: David Klinghoffer (the Discoveroids’ journalistic slasher) has linked Darwin to: Hitler, and communism, and Stalin, and the Columbine shootings, and Charles Manson, and Holocaust Museum shooter, James von Brunn, and the Ft. Hood Massacre, and Mao Tse-tung, and Dr. Josef Mengele, and James Lee, the Discovery Channel Terrorist.

Aside from Klinghoffer’s hatchet-jobs, there was a post by John West about Norwegian terrorist Anders Behring Breivik, which prompted us to write Breivik a “Social Darwinist”. They once blamed a young man’s suicide on Darwin (see Feasting on Death). They’ve even suggested that the American Civil War Was Darwin’s Fault.

James Holmes, the alleged Colorado shooter, had been a med student. It’s “obvious” that he must have been a Darwinist. Surely, it’s not too difficult for the Discoveroids to crank up their propaganda machine and make the most of the situation. This is what they do best, so what are they waiting for?

Copyright © 2012. The Sensuous Curmudgeon. All rights reserved.

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55 responses to “Colorado Shooter James Holmes & Darwin

  1. Charley Horse

    Of course, the most idiotic comments will come from the NRA.
    They will say something remarkably stupid like “more guns
    need to be manufactured and distributed to keep guns out of
    the hands of criminals and nuts”.
    The NRA is very upset here in Tennessee with the Retalibaners
    for not going along with making it illegal for businesses to not
    allow employees to bring their guns onto the businesses’ property.

  2. Curmudgeon” “It’s ‘obvious’ that he must have been a Darwinist.”

    One reported to be “strongly involved in his local church.” But I’ll resist the Klingofferesque knee-jerk reaction and assume that he acted out of his own free will.

  3. NeonNoodle

    But I’ll resist the Klingofferesque knee-jerk reaction and assume that he acted out of his own free will.

    And I thought it was all because of dat b-a-a-a-d ol’ Tea Party.

  4. Every time the creationists blame Darwin for the Nazis, I want to find one and ask him how they explain Vlad the Impaler, Atilla the Hun, human slavery, and the Thirty Years’ War.

  5. Charley Horse

    This morning’s NRA tweet: “Good Morning shooters. Happy Friday!
    Weekend Plans?”

    Later, feeling the pressure, they deleted their Tweeter Account,
    deleted their Facebook account and their website was down for hours.

  6. Charley Horse

    The shooter’s victims can find relief in knowing that they were not
    shot with illegally purchased weapons. The three gunstore owners
    can sleep well tonight, too, knowing that they seem to have broke no
    laws. Smith & Wesson, Glock and Remington gun makers can feel
    good because all three weapons worked as designed. Their reputations
    remain intact.

  7. NeonNoodle

    This morning’s NRA tweet: “Good Morning shooters. Happy Friday!
    Weekend Plans?”
    Later, feeling the pressure, they deleted their Tweeter Account,
    deleted their Facebook account and their website was down for hours.

    Pretty insensitive. I’m still disgusted that they hijacked the acronym of the National Recovery Administration, and it’s eagle symbol.

  8. Jack Hogan

    I am certain James Holmes’ connections with Darwin and evolution are being scientifically researched by the thoroughly scientific science researchers at the DI, probably using the same methodology and tools Brian Ross used to connect him with the Tea Party.

  9. Well, he studied neuroscience, he clearly thinks that our minds are just wired to do whatever they do, right?

    Contra Charley Horse, I don’t believe shredding more of our Constitutional rights, in order to keep us “safe”, is the answer. If the liberty we’ve already been deprived of hasn’t done it, I don’t think a little more is going to do it.

    What would have stopped him from setting off a pipe bomb in a theater? Pipe control, obviously. And household chemical control.

  10. Gabriel Hanna says: “What would have stopped him from setting off a pipe bomb in a theater? Pipe control, obviously.”

    If he had stabbed his victims with frozen asparagus, we’d need vegetable control.

  11. SC: we’d need vegetable control.

    There’s no background check, or waiting period, for purchasing gasoline, pipe, nails, fireworks…. If we learned anything from 9/11, we should have learned that practically anything can be made a weapon.

  12. @Aitch748:human slavery

    Didn’t catch that before… are there other kinds?

  13. He was a neuroscientist grad student. Neuroscientists like Greene and Haidt, among many others, have worked awfully hard to show that the putative part of the brain that is concerned with making “emotional” deontological moral choices like “Thou shall not murder” is a more “primitive” part of the brain than the more “evolved” area that is concerned with, say, utilitarian rules, like “Do whatever brings the most pleasure” (e.g. Peter Singer who believes murdering two year olds is quite OK). Now, I have no doubt that Holmes fully understood the implications of such a “science”. How come you guys just don’t get it? Or are you just self-blinded to what a belief in survival of the fittest and evolutionary “morality” can bring a person to do?

  14. @Marc:How come you guys just don’t get it? Or are you just self-blinded to what a belief in survival of the fittest and evolutionary “morality” can bring a person to do?

    Cue the Poe’s Law self-parody. Klinghoffer couldn’t have said it better.

  15. @Marc: “Kill them all, God will recognize His own.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacre_at_B%C3%A9ziers

    How come you don’t get it? Or are you just self-blinded to what a belief in absolute obedience to Divine commands can bring a person to do?

  16. Bob Carroll

    Charlet H, in the second para of your first comment above, is that a triple negative, or what? It’s getting late in the evening for me, apparently, ’cause I can’t figure it out.

  17. “Pretty insensitive. I’m still disgusted that they hijacked the acronym of the National Recovery Administration, and it’s eagle symbol.”

    For some reason this thread has attracted a couple of the idiot savants of the “disarm the law abiding citizens” lobby.

    The National Rifle Association was founded in 1871. Being a national organization it has utilized our national symbols, including the eagle, for obvious reasons, long before the National Recovery Administration existed.

    The National Recovery Administration was created in 1933. It was ruled unconstitutional in 1935. Its symbol of a blue eagle looks nothing like the National Rifle Association’s eagle.

    Go bash the National Rifle Association somewhere else, guys. No one here is buying your BS.

  18. “Charlet H, in the second para of your first comment above, is that a triple negative, or what? It’s getting late in the evening for me, apparently, ’cause I can’t figure it out.”

    Don’t try. It is the Worm Ouroboros of hoplophobia: swallowing his own verbiage until he devours himself.

  19. “If he had stabbed his victims with frozen asparagus, we’d need vegetable control.”

    Also: freezer control.

    You can go buy your ice cubes at the local Kwik-E-Mart just like everyone else, Citizen!

  20. Gabriel,

    “How come you don’t get it? Or are you just self-blinded to what a belief in absolute obedience to Divine commands can bring a person to do?”

    Excellent debating skills: throw in a double measure of informal fallacies, to wit, the red herring and begging the question.

    Apropos the latter, let’s assume that it is completely historically true that the Pope in question did issue the command to slay these people, would you like to lay out, for your audience, how the celestial hotline travels from that order back to God?

    BTW, I like how you COMPLETELY ignored the ENTIRE point of my post. How very politically shrewd, and convenient, of you. I think I’ll call such tactics, hmm… a Rumsfeld. Has a nice American ring to it.

    When you get a moment, why don’t you go back and read something about the subject creationists have been talking about rather than burying your head in a pile of sand and throwing up irrelevant “counter-examples”.

  21. @Marc: For all you know that guy’s a creationist. Maybe that’s why he was quitting grad school.

  22. Charley Horse

    Quote Gabriel Hanna: ” If we learned anything from 9/11, we should have learned that practically anything can be made a weapon.”

    Yeah, 9/11…the day before Bush’s inauguration..

    Perhaps Hanna and Marc can work out their differences in Tampa
    next month. A reminder…leave your water guns at home. Only deadly weapons will be allowed. :)

  23. Rick Warren blames evolution, although not specifically Darwin.

    https://twitter.com/RickWarren/status/226378218456899584

  24. Marc, your ridiculous strawmen of utilitarian ethics, of Peter Singer’s ideas, and of neuroscience do not deserve anything other than a flippant dismissal, which is what Gabriel Hanna gave you.

    And for the record, people who believe “God” is instructing them–or simply on their side–can justify any horror they’d care to inflict on their fellow human beings. And have. You’d have to be pretty stupid to deny that.

  25. Ellie says: “Rick Warren blames evolution, although not specifically Darwin.”

    It’s the same at Ken Ham’s site. It’s the first item in their weekly news summary, where they say:

    We do not proclaim that “evolution” causes people to plan assaults on theaters. But in a world where an evolutionary worldview tries to write God out of history …

  26. @Charley:Yeah, 9/11…the day before Bush’s inauguration..

    Partisan feces-flinging irrelevant to the topic, check. Now have you got ANYTHING substantive in response to anything I or meh said? No.

  27. Charley Horse

    Well, Hanna, I could of mentioned Bush’s war to destroy imaginary
    weapons. That war on imaginary weapons murdered thousands of
    US soldiers and more than a 100,000 Iraqis….that’s why Bush is known
    as a mass killer that was never tried for the crime.
    But I didn’t mention that….:)

  28. Breivik in Norway was a psycho with a complex anti-liberal agenda, and a lot of guns. The Colorado shooter was a psycho, with a lot of
    guns. The dead and wounded in Aurora Colorado rivaled the Damascus casualties that day. The NRA would say one concealed hand gun permit in the theater would have stopped the gunman. So, the more guns in society, the fewer the violent deaths. Makes sense to a creationist probably. And normal conservative Americans, today classified as liberals, are not likely to carry a gun in any event. Even better if you’re a Wackoid sphere inhabitant. .The Tute could have a great spin going on this one. What an opportunity for them! The Discoveroid Monday morning staff meeting should be a real humdinger.

  29. Curmudgeon et al, it’s harder to kill other human beings with frozen asparagus than it is to pick up a Glock and start blasting away. Any idiot can shoot people with ease. Frozen asparagus takes a lot more planning and traing. Did anyone read about multiple mass murders in the UK last week like we had here? Germany? France? Italy? Me neither. Those nations have their own strengths and weaknesses. Going forward, there will be more of this, not less. Assault weapons, auto hand guns permeating society is bad, not good. Hunting weapons?
    Sure, no problem.
    Assault weapons and auto handguns have ONLY one purpose when employed as intended. The killing of human beings.
    The gun rights activists I know are universally
    conservative in many of their views, up to and including creationism. The last time I went to a range to scope in my hunting rifles I was genuinely concerned for my safety. There were rude and aggressive dumbasses blasting away
    ( most were lousy marksmen).
    Easy access tp guns has made our society less safe due to the ease with which the individual can act on his/her impulses.
    The price of freedom? I wish I were more
    comfortable with that concept. It seems very
    Baghdad to me. However one views this broad issue, be careful out there.

  30. will says: “Curmudgeon et al, it’s harder to kill other human beings with frozen asparagus than it is to pick up a Glock and start blasting away. Any idiot can shoot people with ease.”

    That’s good to know. I’ll eat the asparagus and buy a Glock.

  31. Charley Horse, Okay! I’m not a fan of Bush/Cheney et al. You’re on target with a religion/ creationoid world view with regards to the “mass murder” thing. It’s the opposite of Darwin causes mass murder.
    War sucks, it’s causes are complex.
    It’s consequences are brutal. Bush’s tenure
    won’t be treated well by historians. And,
    he is an IDer. Would events be unfolding in the Middle East as they are anyway if Bush hadn’t gone in? Probably, but at a slower pace? We should be concerned about what a creationoid world view, which extends beyond science and religion, means for us right here at home , I agree. Warfare and violence is intolerance at its zenith , on either side. Juvenile chimps form packs and patrol the boundaries of their territory. Intruders are chased down and torn to shreds. There is a better way
    than escalation on all sides. Discourse, logic, reason in a perfect world. We’re in trouble and possibly headed towards even worse extinction events than we’ve seen so far. “Imagine” but I think . nature is something that will always continue to challenge our ability to transcend.
    Jeez, shut up Will

  32. Curmudgeon, ok but your pee is going to smell funny while you load up those mags.. Just sayin.

  33. Oops, that sounded harsh when the intent was
    humor. I just tried the frozen asparagus approach. The target laughed at me and the
    was crunchy when eaten. Switching to broccoli
    which is kind of an anti Bush position statement.

  34. retiredsciguy

    Curmy, according to Alfred Hitchcock, a frozen leg of lamb is more effective as a murder weapon than your asparagus.

  35. retiredsciguy says: ” a frozen leg of lamb is more effective as a murder weapon than your asparagus.”

    I recall a story where the killer used a knife made of a splinter of dry ice. No traces.

  36. retiredsciguy

    @Gabriel Hanna: “Didn’t catch that before… are there other kinds?” (Referring to human slavery.)

    W. Somerset Maugham evidently thought so when he wrote Of Human Bondage in 1915. PETA members probably think so too, and they’d use the asparagus instead of a leg of lamb.

    And yes, just about anything could be used as a murder weapon. Guns just make the whole process so much easier. I don’t have a problem with those who would restrict handguns or firearms — as long as they do it in accordance with the Constitution. In other words, pass an amendment.

  37. Charley Horse, I agree with Gabriel Hanna, .
    you nailed Poe’s Law . There have been
    ALOT of deaths related to religious extremism.
    If you’re serious on your Darwin-shooter
    link the counter is this. Assuming Darwin
    is linked to those deaths, which is an idiots
    argument anyway, then the hundreds of millions
    of llives saved or extended due to modern medicine put your argument where it belongs,
    in the garbage. Hope you were in fact
    kidding. ( I’m dense ask everyone) Hanna
    nailed that in two sentences,

  38. @Ellie:

    Rick Warren’s quote may be mindlessy parroted, but it’s 100% correct. Since learning that I’m an animal, I have refrained from photosynthesizing.

  39. And this tidbit

    hmmmmm.

    maybe the Discoveroids won’t be touting this one after all.
    If they do, there will have to be some fact twisting ..
    Hey Kapoople Flinger, you’re up!!

    The below doesn’t mean Holmes is a creationoid, but it seems
    curious.

    “James Eagan Holmes is being described by folks who knew him as “heavily involved in his local Presbyterian church,” reports the Christian Post.”

  40. @Frank J:
    I’m stealing that line.

  41. Retired Prof

    @will, like you I own no firearms but sporting ones. Makes me feel a little guilty, because I realize that our country may deteriorate and throw at us what the Declaration of Independence describes as “a long train of abuses and usurpations,” and demonstrate “a design to reduce [us] under absolute Despotism.” In such circumstances, it is our right, our duty, “to throw off such Government.”

    If things came to that pass, you and I would naturally press our deer rifles into service, but to be effective, the citizen militia needs to be armed with weapons at least roughly comparable to what soldiers carry.

  42. docbill1351

    I would like to point out to all these thoughtless morons who think that people packing heat in the theater would have made things better are nuts. I can shoot a pistol and I’m not bad on a range, but in a dark theater with smoke and some nut somewhere spraying AK-47 rounds, my only thought would be GTFO!

    Seriously, these insane commentators think that I’m Jason Bourne. We’ll, I’m not. I’m Will Ferrell and I’m going to shoot lights, the floor, other patrons and after nine trigger pulls I’m going to be out of ammo having killed who knows how many innocent people.

    But, hey, it’s my Second Amendment right to kill my fellow citizens. All good.

  43. docbill1351

    So for the legal beagles out there what’s the call. If I’m packing heat in a movie theater and I shoot at a baddie but kill a bunch of innocent people am I off the hook, or am I up for manslaughter?

  44. Retired prof . I agree sir.
    I hope the far right doesn’t take us
    there. Building a lot of creationoid non thinkers
    using school vouchers as Jindal is trying to do,
    cutting education budgets , Discotute propaganda and SBOE Texas style butchery of science education standards can lead us to
    ,,,,,,,,,,,,, Hezbollah , a nation of Dark Agers.
    If there are major food or energy disruptions or nuclear terrorism America won’t react in a
    UK WWII Blitz fashion. The Landover Baptist Church Gun Club will be out there. Ever Google
    Landover Baptist? My favorite item in the church store? ” The Love Me or Burn” bumper sticker. It’s good natured stuff .Check it out. :)

  45. @Doc Bill: Don’t know. It wouldn’t have mattered if you were Jason Bourne, though. The psychopath was wearing body armor, including groin protection. In other words, he was wearing stuff similar to what our troops in harm’s way (think Iraq and Afghanistan) wear. Your pistol (unless you happened to be packing a serious blunderbuss, such as a Desert Eagle) would have only annoyed him.
    But you’re not Jason Bourne. I’m not Jason Bourne. No one is Jason Bourne. He’s a mythical character. A real person shooting at another human being, even from close range, will most likely miss. The only exceptions are those who have been trained for it. Look at the guy in Florida who foiled a robbery by shooting at the two perps. He fired 7 or 8 times from close range, yet both of the kids lived. From what I understand, their wounds were not even life threatening. My younger brother, a cop, was once in a firefight. He and three other cops got into a gun battle with a guy wielding an AK-47. He was in a house; they were outside the front door. At one point, he came running out firing wildly. Despite the fact that the cops each emptied their magazines (13 round semi-auto pistols for a total of 52 rounds), they only hit him twice. The closest cop was less than 6 feet; the furthest was only about 12 feet. Indianapolis, where my brother works, had another gun battle. A psycho similar to the idiot in question. He was walking around his neighborhood just shooting at everything that moved. He killed the first officer, Tim Laird, who arrived on the scene. He wounded the next three. Fortunately, the fourth one was a member of the SWAT team. Despite the fact that he’d been wounded, he managed to get out of his car, open his trunk, take out his assault rifle, load it, chamber a round, and fire back, killing the psycho. Indy has a fairly well-trained SWAT team. And an assault rifle (an M-4 in this case) is not a pistol.
    I’ve never been in a firefight. But I have been in fires. One of the important lessons I learned as a firefighter was that you have absolutely no idea how people will react in a very bad situation until you put them in it. Yes, you can run tests, you can try to hypothesize and try other things. But until they’re actually in that bad situation, you won’t know. Fortunately, in firefighter training, you can find out who will bug out. Put them into a fire scenario with actual fire and see who blinks. I saw it time and again. Guys would act all macho and talk big, until they put on the mask and had to take the nozzle inside. All of sudden, they’re running out the door. Their partners are left to try to handle a 100 psi nozzle with one man short. Suffice to say, they were not allowed firefighter certification, which kept them off of the fire engines. I firmly believe the same principle applies here. If someone had had a weapon, would they have just started firing crazily? Or not fired at all and just froze up? Or perhaps they found their “Jason Bourne” and fired well-aimed shots? Again, who knows?
    The point is moot. No one did. The psycho managed to kill 12 and wound dozens of others. There’s no rhyme or reason to it. Don’t try and find it. No one is going to get justice out of this particular situation.

  46. retiredsciguy

    @Gary: Well said!

    There may have been some mass shootings where the presence of an armed citizen would have made a difference; Aurora probably was not one of them.

  47. docbill1351 says: “I would like to point out to all these thoughtless morons who think that people packing heat in the theater would have made things better are nuts.”

    [*Cough, cough*] Well, don’t get me wrong. I don’t think a bunch of cross-fire in the movie theater would have been a good thing, but there’s a reason the guy chose to do what he did at a movie theater. It’s the same reason muggers prefer to target little old ladies carrying handbags, rather than trying to mug uniformed policemen. It’s also why holdup men generally don’t try to rob gun stores. What am I getting at? Simply this — psychos aside (because they’re unpredictable) — criminals choose easy targets, unarmed victims, victims who can’t defend themselves.

  48. retiredsciguy

    To get back on to the main topic of this blog — as docbill states, most people’s only thought would be to GTFO. Not coincidentally, they are the ones most likely to pass their genes along to the next generation.

    The hero who stays behind and altruistically attempts to shoot the much-better-armed psycho so that others may live is more likely to be killed than those fleeing. Arming yourself to enhance your chances of survival might work when you have no possibility of escape, but that was not the case in Aurora.

    On the other hand, if most citizens were armed, it would give pause to potential muggers, home invaders, store robbers, car-jackers, etc., but it would not stop a mass killer such as James Holmes, who was wearing body armor and likely felt invincible. Or, as was earlier pointed out, he would just resort to other means, such as a pipe bomb.

    Nor would an armed citizenry prevent the urban gang warfare shootings that are so prominently reported in our cities. Perhaps an answer to that is to make ammunition much more difficult to obtain.

  49. Gabriel Hanna

    If there is an axiomatic error at the heart of progressive reasoning, it is this: words are equivalent to actions.

    The movie theater was a declared weapon-free zone. Virginia Tech was a declared weapon-free zone. Washington, D. C., until 2008, was a declared weapons-free zone. When you put up signs declaring an area weapon-free, the Magic Gun Fairy does not keep watch over it, disintegrating weapons as they enter. Making the entire United States a declared weapon-free zone will not make all guns disappear.

    What will make them disappear is house to house searches for guns, metal detectors and searches at sensitive areas, (which will include movie theaters, you can be sure) etc. In other words, the sort of massive and widespread violation of civil liberties which progressives claim they are against, but in reality always argue for.

    And it will not make us safer. The declared weapon-free zone of the United Kingdom has violent crime rates several times higher than the United States. Not only will be be giving up permanent liberty to secure a little temporary safety, we will not even get the safety. A crime very common in the UK is unheard of in the US: hot burglary, when you rob a house while the family is at home. In the UK this is the safest time to rob a house because the alarms are off and the family is legally required to be defenseless. They still have mass shootings, and failing that you can always bomb the Tube, can’t you?

    One of the biggest sellers in sports equipment in the UK is baseball bats. They don’t play baseball there. They use them as clubs. Clearly they need bat control.

    A gun gives a weak person, or an old person, or a woman, a chance. Maybe some concealed-weapons holders wouldn’t have changed the outcome in Aurora. But guns would have given the audience-goers options besides cowering and waiting to be murdered, or piling up at the exits to be murdered. There might have been only 3 or 4 people killed.

    James Holmes surrendered without resistance to the one group of armed people who confronted him.

  50. Gabriel Hanna

    And besides, with as many bombs as that guy made, what would have stopped him from using bombs in the theater? We don’t have pipe control, or gasoline control. Only one thing would have stopped him: surveillance, security, and searches at every movie theater, every public place that attracts crowds. Is that how we want to live in this country?

    Charley Horse’s irrelevant Bush-lied-us-into-Iraq hobbyhorse is useful for one thing: the argument I’ve made above is exactly the one progressives like him used to argue against the PATRIOT Act. And out of the other side of their mouths they argue for more far-reaching and fundamental violations of civil liberties.

  51. Gabriel Hanna

    Oh, pardon me for neglecting to give President Obama and the Democrats the share of the credit for the Patriot Act: he signed it into law in 2011, after the Senate voted 72 to 23 to reauthorize it.

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/05/26/reid_rand_pauls_opposition_to_patriot_act_giving_terrorists_the_opportunity_to_plot_against_our_country.html

    Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) blasted Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) on the Senate floor late Wednesday night. Reid called Rand Paul’s opposition to the renewal of the PATRIOT Act “political grandstanding.” However, that wasn’t the worst thing Reid accused the freshman Senator from Kentucky of.

    “When the clock strikes midnight tomorrow, we will be giving terrorists the opportunity to plot against our country undetected,” Reid said on the Senate floor. “Now, the Senator from Kentucky is threatening to take away the best tools we have for stopping them.”

  52. Good point about the Patriot Act, Gabe.

  53. Spector567

    There is an arguent of extremes going on here.
    the answer is not to arm all citizens as the NRA would have us do.
    Nore is it to get rid of all weapons as others would have us do.

    The idea is to find some reasonable middle ground.

    My theory on the matter is that guns should be big and Loud.
    You don’t need a semi-automtic to protect your home. Nore do you need an easily conceeled pee shooter.
    You need a shot gun. Big loud, can’t miss and will wake the entire neibourhood and bring everyone running.
    There are also a huge number of other items from tasers to mace that can be used hand held at close range.

  54. retiredsciguy

    @Spector567: The government insists that I keep my pee shooter concealed while in public. I face stiff penalties if I fail to do so.

    Your point is well-taken, though. However, the Second Amendment makes no such distinction concerning our right to bear arms.

  55. These accusations blaming Darwin have much merit. It’s possible that the perpetrator suffered from “mad evil scientist syndrome” MESS. This occurs when a student doesn’t know where the line between objectivity and subjectivity is, and objectivity encroaches on subjectivity, surpressing and destroying all emotions in the process. Mostly this is caused by evolution theory, which scientific theory tends to blur the line between subjective and objective. Creationism acknowledges this line clearly, the line is at choices. What choses is a matter of subjective opinion, what is chosen is a matter of objective fact.

    But then some creationists regard the existence of God and the soul as established matters of fact (properly God and the soul chose, so therefore can only be identified with a choice). Particularly creationists who are reactionary against evolutionist do this, because evolutionists always require evidence for God from creationists. Thos creationists might also suffer from MESS.