ICR: Jason Lisle & Vernon Cupps, Together

The collapse of the Discoveroids’ website today compells us to dig for more material at the website of the Institute for Creation Research (ICR) — the fountainhead of young-earth creationist wisdom.

We recently learned that ICR Has a Creationist Nuclear Physicist on their payroll. That’s Vernon R. Cupps. And you already know about Jason Lisle, their creationist astrophysicist. Well, dear reader, we found something they recently wrote together. It’s titled Subatomic Particles, Part 3: Mesons.

Don’t let the title bother you. We don’t need to know much about messons to appreciate what the creationist dynamic duo has written. Here are some excerpts, with bold font added by us:

When considering the term subatomic particles, many people typically think of things like electrons, protons, or neutrons. We have some experience with these particles because we were taught about them in school. Indeed, we are made of them — electrons, protons, and neutrons comprise atoms, and atoms comprise our bodies.

Yeah, yeah. We know all that. Moving along:

But a type of particle with mass between leptons and baryons also exists; these are mesons. A bit more mysterious than protons and electrons, mesons have a fleeting existence, lasting only a fraction of a microsecond. But they provide us with great insight into how the laws of physics work and thus the organized and mathematical way that God upholds what He has created.

[*Begin Drool Mode*] Ooooooooooooh! [*End Drool Mode*] Mesons give us insight into divine creation. Let’s read on:

To make sense of mesons, we need to explore how the strong nuclear force operates.

No we don’t. Not for our purposes. Oh wait — this is good:

[T]he strong force has an extremely limited range. This is a phenomenally important design feature because if the strong force had the same infinite range as the electric force, then the former would overwhelm the latter and all the matter in the universe would collapse into a single nucleus. God gave each force the right strength and range so that matter would be possible in all its wondrous forms.

[*Begin Drool Mode*] Ooooooooooooh! [*End Drool Mode*] The strong force was given just the right strength and range! Ignoring the rest of the article, we arrive at their conclusion

Since mesons have only a momentary existence, we might naturally ask what purpose God has for them. There are several possibilities.

[*Begin Drool Mode*] Ooooooooooooh! [*End Drool Mode*] What was God’s purpose? The creation scientists tell us:

For one, they give us great insight into the laws of physics that govern the behavior of all particles. By studying mesons, we can better understand the nature of baryons — like protons and neutrons. In fact, the quark substructure of protons and neutrons might never have been discovered or understood if God had not permitted the existence of mesons.

We could have been spared a lot of trouble if they had been mentioned in the bible. But wait — there’s a little bit more:

Furthermore, mesons challenge our understanding of reality and reveal the creativity of the Lord. Perhaps this is the Lord’s way of reminding us that as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are His thoughts and ways higher than ours.

That’s it. You’ve probably been wondering what would happen if Cupps and Lisle teamed up. Now you know.

Copyright © 2016. The Sensuous Curmudgeon. All rights reserved.

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11 responses to “ICR: Jason Lisle & Vernon Cupps, Together

  1. “You’ve probably been wondering what would happen if Cupps and Lisle teamed up. Now you know.”
    But the resulting pairing does not make it clear if their research is braindeath squared (Bd^2) or braindeath to the braindeath power (Bd^Bd). So I at least still don’t know.

  2. Lisle and Cupps are typical examples of how ID/creationists manage to miss the crucial points of scientific discoveries.

    One of the central tenets of ID/creationism is its belief that the second law of thermodynamics has everything coming all apart after the Fall; the ID/creationists’ second law was designed to “prove” that the Fall happened. It is also the reason that tornados in junkyards are models for ID/creationist “evolution” and for Dembski’s “calculations” of “complex specified information.” All this goes back to Henry Morris and Duane Gish. The world to an ID/creationist is an ideal gas of inert objects.

    However, the universe isn’t coming all apart. Matter condenses. Electrons bind to protons. Protons and neutrons bind to each other. Gravity pulls matter into stars where the periodic table of elements is built up.

    And finally, “neutral” atoms condense into liquids and solids while chemistry produces all sorts of complexity. And, when things bind together, energy is given off and the entropy of the system decreases even as entropy increases overall.

    The story of mesons is one of the more interesting and crucial discoveries in physics; yet here we see Lisle and Cupps missing the crucial point of how mutually repelling protons bind together in a nucleus to form more complex atoms.

    As I keep saying, these characters manage to get their PhDs without leaning what any reasonably bright middle school and high school student learns these days in their science classes. ID/creationists, to a person, bend and break scientific concepts and knowledge as they go.

  3. Lot of standard science with a feeble attempt to make it relevant to creationism. Looks to me like somebody is trying to justify his salary.
    Funny how they are always supposing that the Lord is trying to tell us something. How about the great size of the universe teaching us that we’re not that important? How about the great lengths that God went to create natural mechanisms for such things as the sun’s energy, etc. showing that the creation of the world really was natural, as mainstream science has been saying all along? They never discuss those possibilities.

  4. Charles Deetz ;)

    So the conclusion is … ooh god made an amazing universe. Reminds me of an insipid Eric Hovind video where he names things in the universe and then declares that god created them all to impress us. Lisle/Cups went the other way in scale, but the result is just as silly.

  5. “The collapse of the Discoveroids’ website”
    The IDiots still have this:

    http://www.discovery.org/id/

    and

    http://www.evolutionnews.org/

    with promising titles like “Evolution in Kindergarten:” by Savvy Sarah and “Fossils in Greenland pose an evolutionary dilemma” by Davy Klinkleclapper.

  6. “God gave each force the right strength and range”
    Four forces hence four first causes hence four gods.

  7. Despite giving each force the right strength and range, it turns out that life is so improbable that it takes special divine intervention on even a privileged planet.
    If after all that designing, it still means that life takes some more special attention, why not just skip all that designing and just create man?

  8. “why not just skip all that designing and just create man?”
    Considering how badly humans are “designed”, it is pretty clear that any “designing” was totally skipped – rather like what one would expect from evolution.

  9. “This proof can at most, therefore, demonstrate the existence of an architect of the world, whose efforts are limited by the capabilities of the material with which he works, but not of a creator of the world, to whom all things are subject.”
    Kant, Critique of Pure Reason, A 627, B 655 (Physico-Theological Proof Impossible)

  10. I checked out the Wikipedia article on mesons. At least the IDiots give me a reason to look up stuff. It turns out, not unexpectedly, that mesons are quite a bit more complicated than our ICR P.H.Duds make them out to be. There are 140 meson critters, some known, some predicted. For example, you’ve got your Charmed Eta Meson comprised of a charmed quark and a charmed antiquark that hangs around for 10^-23 of a second. Charming.

    In the article I don’t know who’s the most flowery, Cupp or Lisle. The next guy they need to hire is David Rives to do the final editing and video production. That would be, well, heavenly glorious!

  11. Jeez, where to begin.

    [T]he strong force has an extremely limited range. This is a phenomenally important design feature because if the strong force had the same infinite range as the electric force, then the former would overwhelm the latter and all the matter in the universe would collapse into a single nucleus. God gave each force the right strength and range so that matter would be possible in all its wondrous forms.

    According the recent theoretical work in physics, it turns out that the fundamental forces could vary in strength without making matter impossible or collapsing the univese.

    Since mesons have only a momentary existence, we might naturally ask what purpose God has for them. There are several possibilities.

    For one, they give us great insight into the laws of physics that govern the behavior of all particles. By studying mesons, we can better understand the nature of baryons — like protons and neutrons. In fact, the quark substructure of protons and neutrons might never have been discovered or understood if God had not permitted the existence of mesons.

    I see. So mesons were created so that we humans could gain “insight”
    into “the quark substructure of protons and neutrons.”

    All this kind of blather shows is that ICR has more quacks than a duck. But then, that was already obvious.